Phenylalanine +TCCA - Thread From WD

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Phenylalanine + TCCA Revival Printed from: WetDreams ®eloaded Topic URL: http://www.wetdreams.ws/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1431 Printed on: Nov 21 2007

Topic: Topic author: tina_craig Subject: Phenylalanine + TCCA Revival Posted on: Dec 27 2005 08:54:00 AM Message: This is part of a thread from the archive that switc had started but swifishinabottle and swining were the big contributors to. With the pseudoephedrine situation going the way its going, switc was hoping maybe this thread would pick back up. ning The One-Pot King

Posted - Mar 04 2005 : 11:00:02 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------you speak sooth my brother, for the gods of scifinder say "sparingly soluble". However, the mighty substance doth dissolveth well in acetone, a cosolvent commonly employed in our craft when water alone will not suffice. I have found the sodium salt, it comes cheaply granulated. Perhaps for the reaction of phenylalanine to benzyl cyanide, it would indeed be better employed. I suggest following the literature procedure first however, before innovating, especially when yields are already good. A good point nonetheless. Boogie, lovely! In awe! So cool, the colors--like real chemistry should look! A childs chemistry set! So, tell me-orange = Ph-CH(CN)COCH3 ? blue/green = Ph-CH(CONH2)COCH3, Ph-CH(COOH)COCH3 ? and then decarboxylated into clear P2P? Is p2p clear, come to think of it? ugh...showing my weakness here, heh.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 144 madnessrules Master Dreamer

Posted - Mar 05 2005 : 01:17:15 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------I suggest following the literature procedure first however -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Please point me to this reference I must have overlooked it. Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593 ning The One-Pot King

Posted - Mar 05 2005 : 10:52:53 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Sorry, here it is: BTW, no acetone here. That makes matters simpler. "An insight of the reaction of amines with trichloroisocyanuric acid" De Luca & Giacomelli Synlett 2004, No. 12, pp 2180 R-CH(COOH)NH2 ------> R-C#N (TCCA/H2O/NaOH/5 C) Amino acid Nitrile time(h) Yield(%) ---------------------------------------------------------------Ph-CH2-CH(COOH)NH2 Ph-CH2-C#N 0.4 98 HOOC-CH2-CH(COOH)NH2 HOOC-CH2-C#N 1.0 99 HOOC-CH2-CH2-CH(COOH)NH2 HOOC-CH2-CH2-C#N 0.5 90 BnOPh-CH2-CH(COOH)NH2 BnOPh-CH2-C#N 1.0 93 CH3-CH2-CH(CH3)-CH(COOH)NH2 CH3-CH2-CH(CH3)-C#N 0.5 98

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The reaction can be preformed with 2/3 equivalents of TCCA directly on an aqueous solution of the alpha-aminoacid under basic conditions: after 30 minutes to 1 hour, the nitriles can be recovered quantitatively without any trace of byproducts. It is worth mentioning to note that in the case of amino acids having multiple chiral centers such as isoleucine the reaction occurs without any racemization of the adjacent chiral center. [...] General One-Pot Procedure. The reported procedure is representative: L-Phenylalanine (1.2 g, 7.6 mmol) was dissolved in an aq solution of 2 N NaOH (3.8 mL) and treated with TCCA (1.17 g, 5.1 mmol) at 25 C. After 10 min, when TLC analysis showed the complete absence of the L-phenylalanine, the reaction mixture was treated with HCl (15 mL), followed by an aq solution of 3 N HCl (2.5 mL). After 10 min the mixture was extracted twice with Et2O (15 mL). The organic layers were washed with H2O (10 mL), dried on Na2SO4, filtered and concentrated in vacuo to yield phenylacetonitrile (0.87 g, 98%) WTF don't the tables come out right???


Posted - Mar 06 2005 : 2:07:41 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Wow! Great! Thats something, thanks! Yes the NaOH is it I guess... .. you may have a look at into the chloroform thread btw. Well, now somebody explain this to WizardX - it works in water....

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593 ning The One-Pot King

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Posted - Mar 06 2005 : 6:17:01 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Get the full paper if you can, it's got mechanisms in it. R-CH(COOH)NH2 --> R-CH(COOH)NCl2 --(somehow)-->R-C#N It seems to work like one would expect a typical N-chlorination to work (by generation of HOCl, etc)-The thing that makes me wonder is how the -COOH group causes the easy conversion to nitrile--I have some other papers where they do it to primary amines (R-CH2-NH2 --> R-CH2-NCl2 --pyr/Et3N--> R-C#N), but they need pyridine or triethylamine to make it work. On alpha-aminoacids, however, only the base is necessary. Maybe: R-CH(COO-)-NH2 --> R-CH(COO-)-NCl2 --> R-C(COO-)=NCl --> R-C(COO)=N + Cl- --> R-C#N + CO2 a simultaneous transfer of charge from the carboxylate to the chloride, which then leaves, and decarboxylation. This could happen in a six-membered transition-state, but only in alpha-amino acid. Hmmm... I really wonder what the nature of the alkaline-TCCA chlorinating species is. Perhaps in-situ generated NaOCl? ning The One-Pot King

Posted - Mar 25 2005 : 12:51:27 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------WARNING! WARNING! Bullshit procedure alert! Happening to be in possesion of some phenylalanine and TCCA, SWIM did a little preliminary labwork. Here is a recounting of the sordid details: The procedure of the "An insight into the reaction of amines..." paper for phenylalanine was followed to the letter, except all quantities were scaled up by a factor of 1.6 2 grams phenylalanine was treated with a solution of 500 mg NaOH in 6 mL water (2N). It tested litmus alkaline, indicating neutralization of phenylalanine. 3 g 66% TCCA pool shock was set aside to be added in portions with stirring. The phenylalanine solution was cloudy but it did fully dissolve. The mixture was placed in a shot glass (great microscale reaction vessel), and stirred with a rod. A small portion (~10%) of the TCCA was dropped in and fizzing immediately ensued, followed by a most obnoxious aromatic odor. More was added and rapidly stirred. The mixture got warm. It was allowed to sit, and it solidified to a white, mushy mass--this was likely the cyanuric acid precipitate. Some more TCCA was added with fizzing, then more, then the rest was dumped in. Stir stir stir stir, fizz fizz fizz. Stirring was stopped as SWIM carried the vessel towards the window to open it, and FOOM!! The contents of the vessel geysered out and filled the space with smoke and crap.

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Cursing the original paper writers' negiligence, swim got a beaker full of cold water and dumped the vessel in to quench it, wiped up as much as possible, and opened a window. Upon emptying the beaker, it was found to be coated with an oily layer of the same obnoxious aromatic-smelling compound. Acetone removed it, and the remaining persistant odor was found to be destroyed well by oxy-clean percarbonate bleaching compound. So, a mixed bag. It appears the reaction is correct and successful, but also there is some stupid mistake in the procedure. First, I find it hard to believe only 3.8 mL of water was used by the experimenters. This much water is not enough to dissolve the TCCA, and is turned into a mud the consistency of wet plaster-of-paris by the cyanuric acid precipitate. I doubt a magnetic stirrer would be able to spin a bar in it. Second, the temperature may have been too high. In one part of the paper they say 25 C. In another, they say 5 C. The second could be a typo (the first procedure using DMF and triethylamine ran at 25 C), but in light of swim's little blowout, maybe not. But then, I suspect the cyanuric acid sludge would be even harder to stir when cold. So WTF? Perhaps they meant 38 mL water? Nonetheless, the combination of water-insoluble, slightly orange oily stinking aromatic material which made swim feel lightheaded and sick after breathing it, the bubbling which didn't smell like much when TCCA was added (release of CO2, probably), and many similar literature procedures NOT by the same l00sers all suggest that what was made and painted on the walls was, in fact BnCN. So what do y'all make of that? Here's a funny one: Benzyl cyanide occurs in nature. It's the biggest nitrile component in the scent pheremone produced in the belly glands of the australian koala, used as a sex/anti-sex pheremone by white cabbage moths and desert locusts, and is a minor constituent in unripe cranberries, citrus flower oil (used in eau de cologne) and the volatile fraction of human shit! Hmmm.... madnessrules Master Dreamer

Posted - Mar 25 2005 : 05:53:50 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------3 g 66% TCCA pool shock -------------------------------------------------------------------------------This puzzles me. TCCA is here where I live available in tablets containing 100% TCCA. 66% PoolShock refers here always to calcium hypochlorite with 66% available chlor.... Might be regional. Yes the wonderworld of TCCA-runaways.... /fish

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Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593 psuedonymph WD Secretary of the Interior: Kung-Futon Master

Posted - Mar 25 2005 : 10:06:20 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------3 g 66% TCCA pool shock was set aside to be added in portions with stirring.

ning, are you sure that any impurities didn't mess with the reaction? Are you sure that wasn't DCCA you used? Swim has noticed that many OTC pool chlorines are graded by the percentage of available chlorine, and not the strength of the acid. It is important for dreamers to check labels carefully. Pure TCCA is ~ 90% available chlorine. Pure DCCA is ~ 60%+ available chlorine. The physical and chemical properties of trichloro and dichloro isocyanuric acids are: Trichloroisocyanuric acid - C3Cl3N3O3; mole. wt. 232.42. C 15-50%, Cl 45.77%, N 18.08%, 0 20.65%. Prepared by chlorinating cyanuric acid in 5% NaOH solution: Hands, Whitt., Soc. Chem. Ind. 67,66 (1948); Hardy U.S. pat. 2,607,738 (1952 to Monsanto). Purification by dissolving in conc. H2SO4 and diluting with ice water: Lorenz, U.S. pat. 2,828,308 (1958 to Purex Corp.). May be stored in the dry state for at least a year. Releases hypochlorous acid on contact with water. Available chlorine about 90%. pH of aqueous soln. about 4.4. Solubility in water at 25oC about 0.2%. Soluble in chlorinated and highly polar solvents. Dichloroisocyanuric acid - C3Cl2NaN3O3, Sodium Dichloroisocyanurate (SDIC) is white crystal powder, granular (8-30 or 20-60 mesh) or tablets (20, 30, 50, 100, 150 and 200 gm). SDIC is widely applied for the sterilization of swimming pool and drinking water, or fighting against infectious diseases, or act as disinfectant in raising silkworm, livestock, poultry and fish raising. Other applications are also found in wool shrinkage, textile bleaching, and industrial circulating water cleaning. CAS No. 2893-78-9, Formula C3O3N3Cl3Na Physical appearance: powder, granular, tablets Available chlorine: 56% min.; 60% min. pH value (1% water solution): 5.5 - 7.0 Packing: by 25 or 50 kg plastic drums UN No. 2465, Class 5.1

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A nihilist that demands good manners, now there's an oxymoron for ya. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: Kyrgyzstan | Posts: 305 ning The One-Pot King

Posted - Mar 26 2005 : 8:01:44 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Well, it could have been DCCA, the acid. I don't think it was Na.DCCA--although I have been considering using that instead. The ingredients table plainly said: "trichloro-s-triazinetrione 66%, inactive 33%" What that inactive is, I don't know. Very likely it is cyanuric acid. If that is true, then it may well be considered as DCCA, since I suspect TCCA and cyanuric acid would exchange chlorines and equilibrate to DCCA. I don't think it causes the problem though, I think it's the small quanitity of water and sparing solubility of TCCA. Ahh, the crux of the problem: "Solubility in water at 25oC about 0.2%" So, the brazillian guys use 1.6 of TCCA and about 3 mL water, which already has a few grams of phenylalanine dissolved in it. There is no way in hell that stuff will dissolve properly. It's like fricking wet cement! Let it sit and it sets. Probably very prone to run away because reaction rate depends on stirring more than normally. When it isn't stirred, I guess heat accumulates, and since the stuff is so rigid there is no convection to cool it down. FOOM! Use of DCCA is very tempting for this procedure, because as I understand, the TCCA in alkaline solution becomes DCCA anyway. When a chlorine is ejected, the cyanurate remaining absorbs a hydrogen. If there is base, the hydrogen is taken. An imido group has a very low pKa. (RC(=O)-NH-C(=O)R) Since DCCA is much more soluble, it might give less trouble. 25g/100mL H2O, not so bad volumetric efficiency really. The procedure might be retried with: -

more water added constant and rapid stirring DCCA a cosolvent? alkaline bleach instead of TCCA?

I remain convinced that it actually works. Those experimenters should be ashamed of themselves for leaving out essential safety details from their paper. Grrr.

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Posted - Mar 26 2005 : 10:20:10 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------After my experiences with TCCA it would be advised to add the TCCA in portions and to make sure that every portion has reacted before adding a new one. This ensures that no critical mass of TCCA leading to a runaway is present. This may take some more time than told in the paper, but it also takes away the solubility problem. /fish Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593 psuedonymph WD Secretary of the Interior: Kung-Futon Master

Posted - Mar 28 2005 : 03:52:02 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Solubility in water at 25oC about 0.2%. Soluble in chlorinated and highly polar solvents. I wonder whether, utilising a dual solvent system of (OTC) DCM and water would be beneficial in regards to the problems encountered in ning's experiment? The limited solubility of DCM and H2O would slow the exothermic reaction right down, and the use of DCM would also help solve the TCCA solubility issue. Compensate with longer reaction time, strong stirring and a reflux condenser. Any thoughts?

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A nihilist that demands good manners, now there's an oxymoron for ya. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: Kyrgyzstan | Posts: 305 ning The One-Pot King

Posted - Mar 28 2005 : 11:07:23 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------They say it works, and don't mention anything about secondary solvents. Although that method might work, it makes the procedure much less attractive. I think Na.DCCA would be what swim tries next, being highly soluble in water and easy to come by. Also, swim did add the TCCA in portions, stirring between each. After each portion, there was vigorous bubbling, which didn't smell like chlorine (likely to be CO2). After that bubbling subsided, the mixture was stirred more and another portion added. swim will try again with TCCA, adding water as seems necesary to keep the cement from setting and keeping the temperature down. Possibly a test-tube clamped in an ice-bath. Explosion precautions will be taken. Also, more base will be added in the hopes that it will help solublize the generated cyanuric acid. Oh well...


Posted - Mar 28 2005 : 11:09:19 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------The problems are not with the solubility of the TCCA. The problems are that to much TCCA was added to fast so a runaway could take place. More time between the additions might help. NOT to stirr might even help more as the stirring can hinder the TCCA to react as it cannot buildt up a critical local concentration - one may notice that the reaction kicked in AFTER stirring was stopped. The reaction with TCCA is based on the mechanism that HCl is formed and this HCl releases more Cl from the TCCA, but when you stirr in a basic environment you will distribute the formed HCl and it probably will get neutralized. This is of course just an ad-hoc theory, but it is based on much experience with TCCA.

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The second problem is: A shotglass is no flask. The good thing is: The article states a quantitative conversion. This makes me hope that when the shit stays in the flask it will be BzCN. Btw, the final addition of HCl is necessary to ensure all TCCA is reacted, the use of alkaline conditions at start ensures the phenylalanine is present as its soluble salt. /fish Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593 ning The One-Pot King

Posted - Mar 28 2005 : 3:53:34 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Indeed. But Fish, you really should see what it's like. The experiment isn't difficult. I caution you, for your own sake, to have a fume hood handy. I would not be surprised if BnCN is as stinky as phenylacetic acid. Swim says that the quantities involved in the microscale process tried were enough to smell up a house with its obnoxious nauseating solvent/perfume smell, and because it's not water soluble, it's troublesome to clean off surfaces. Be warned. PhCH2CH(COO-)NH2 + Cl, - HCl --> PhCH2C(COO-)=NH + Cl, - NaCl --> PhCH2C#N + CO2 I guess. swim had another try, with modifications. 12 mmol phenylalanine (2 g) 12 mmol NaOH (0.48 g) 8 mmol TCCA (66%, 2.8 g) The phenylalanine and NaOH were mixed, and 10 ml water added, stirred to dissolve. This time the shot glass was placed in a small tub with some ice and cold water. The TCCA was added in about 20 small portions with much stirring between each addition. The progress was like this: After about 5 portions added, the mixture became very thick, full of insoluble crap dispersed. Another 10 mL water was added and stirred in. After 10 portions, oily bubbles were notable on the surface and fizzing was much less when TCCA was added. The consistency was much like whipped cream or egg whites--a dispersion of foamy oily material supporting insoluble bits of cyanuric acid in water. Addition was accelerated without trouble, and after 20 portions, the stuff had become much more liquid, with little blobs of yellowish oil floating on the surface. Success! The stuff was stirred for awhile and a small quantity dumped into 100 mL of concentrated HCl. When no violent reaction was noted, the rest was dumped in and stirred. A small amount of bubbling occured, but not bad.

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This is where the trouble started. The smell was quite hair-raising, and swim lacked proper workup equipment. The aqueous mixture was poured through a coffee filter, which failed to remove the cyanuric acid. Ethanol was used to wash the shot glass through the filter, but this rendered it impossible to separate the layers (duh). swim decided to give up and ditched the equipment into a bucket full of hot water and oxy-clean to destroy the odiferous residues. Well, maybe a bee more equipped than swim could give it a shot? Evidence suggests the procedure to be effective with some care. By the way, when a reaction gets out of control and decides to blast, a shot glass is a much better vessel than a flask. Easy to clean, cheap, designed to be dropped, and with no constrictions to get in the way of the exiting chemicals, I humbly submit that it will be much less likely to put glass shrapnel in your ass. To each their own, of course...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 144 madnessrules Master Dreamer Posted - Mar 28 2005 : 4:13:23 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------By the way, when a reaction gets out of control and decides to blast, a shot glass is a much better vessel than a flask -------------------------------------------------------------------------------there is no "blast", it´s a comfortable runaway no explosion. A flask with a condensore prevent BzCN to be blown out and thats what we want. Thanks for the new test, the smell you noticed puzzles me though. That cyanuric acid is not filterable so easily if at all was stated already in the chloroacetone procedure. Extraction with toluene (or benzene or ether or xylene) is the way to go as I believe. This will be tried soon by me and results posted. /fish Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593

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madnessrules Master Dreamer Posted - Mar 28 2005 : 6:24:38 PM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Experimental: Phenylalanine: 6 g 2N NaOH: 19 ml (5g NaOH + 60ml H2O = 2N NaOH) TCCA: 5,85 g The 2N NaOH was placed in a 200 ml RBF and the phenylalanine was added. Some time later all was dissolved completely, the liquid was clear. An 10 cm extension was put on the flask and the TCCA was added in portions over - say 20 min. Fizzle, fizzle, smoke, the flask was put in a cold water bath and swirled from time to time. Color turned beige, turned light brown and after about half the TCCA was added the shit got semisolid and about 15 ml water were added to get it more liquid again. Let sit for 20 min. - add 80 ml 30% HCl - whuups, this gets the shit going again, cooled and let sit for 20 more minutes. Here was some chlorine evolved, but for the extension and the stopper nothing escaped. Color - creme. Extracted with 2x 50ml benzene (decantation, filteres through glasswool), looks like morning piss now. Thats it so far. Almost no obnoxious odors up to here. Next comes stripping of the benzene and acid hydrolysis and then we will see if this produces the famous stink pf PAA or not. And then we will know more. /fish PS 1: I made pictures and will post them as soon I fixed my problems with getting them onto my machine and when the experiment should prove being successful. PS 2: This needs no sophisticated glassware, a bottle with long neck will do the trick so one is careful with the TCCA additions. The bottle must be large enough to hold the reaction volume + the HCl to add without being more than 2/3 full (volume! Not height!). This leaves enough overhead when there is some more reaction whilst adding the HCl and for the solvent for extraction. Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change -------------------------------------------------------------------------------Country: | Posts: 593 ning The One-Pot King

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Posted - Mar 29 2005 : 09:58:39 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------nicely done. No smell? Very strange. swim reports a VERY noticeable, persistent perfumey aromatic smell. Maybe a condenser keeps it in? Try smelling your benzene (ho ho)-- it shouldn't just smell like benzene. madnessrules Master Dreamer Posted - Mar 30 2005 : 11:37:10 AM Reply Link -------------------------------------------------------------------------------quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------No smell? Very strange. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------As posted, there was some smell, but not too much because of the setup. There was no condensor used just an extension and a large enough flask - a long necked bottle will work as well, no doubt. The reaction seems great up to now - thanks ning for digging this up! I still have to do the stripping and the hydrolysis though, I will keep you all posted. Before this is done I won´t claim success, but it for sure looks good. /fish Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change

Replies: Reply author: stooge Replied on: Jul 12 2006 12:54:29 PM Message: I'm sorry, not trying to profane highly honourable threads with his kindergarden stuff, but swis needs to know this since nothing better to do, swis tried the above with standard Chlorine Bleach, 2,8g per 100ml Did some NaOH-Solution, added some l-Phenylalanine, the Phennylalanine dissolved. Then added some Bleach solution and the stuff went to a clear yellow. After that it became very hot and turned opaque, still yellow like lemonade and has a very strong pleasing smell that goes right up the skull ... wondering what that is - can't be P2P already, no? But what ist it?

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Very baffled on the strong reaction, any hints? Thanks!

Reply author: chi Replied on: Jul 12 2006 5:32:25 PM Message: isolate it and see what properties it has. Reply author: stooge Replied on: Jul 13 2006 09:24:50 AM Message: hm, how? If it was p2p or benzyl cyanide swis simply could boil off the water as both have bp's higher than 200C, but if not ... ? Gonna try anyway, just got to lead the fumes into water or so, only one sniff yesterday caused swis to feel drowsy ... on the other hand - it was really hot and humid yesterday, so not sure if it really was the mix :) will report any outcome of this! thanks *edit: i know it's not very scientific, but the pale orange juice like stuff, after a day sitting had become a rather mean, amoniacal smell, pretty much biting. After heating it became back the more flowery smell from yesterday and some small "drops" of a brown oil, sludge or what ever formed, floating around in the heated brew. Then neutralized by adding dilute HCL and swirling till it stopped fizzing. Now it's of a pale, poisonous looking green-blue and smells very nicely again, remembers somehow of the smell when tinkering around with benzoic acid. There formed some ornage/brownish goo-like stuff sitting down on the bottom of the vessel. Can't explain that at all to myself, but it's kind of colourfull and good smelling :) Darn, if swis could only think what it is ...

Reply author: stooge Replied on: Jul 17 2006 11:16:54 AM Message:

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seems swis is unable to isolate whatever's in there after one night the mix was clear an slightly ice blue - reminded on "ice drops" ... on the top was some green-black tar like stuff that smelld like shit (no joke), like rotten shit, ughh. Would have expected something like that when decarboxylating Tyrosin or so, but not here ... The clear ice blue liquid still smells very sweet and tasty, but seems not to go to evap ... *scratches his grindy head*

Reply author: einsteinnot Replied on: Dec 20 2006 1:48:10 PM Message: Quote: Originally posted by stooge I'm sorry, not trying to profane highly honourable threads with his kindergarden stuff, but swis needs to know this since nothing better to do, swis tried the above with standard Chlorine Bleach, 2,8g per 100ml Did some NaOH-Solution, added some l-Phenylalanine, the Phennylalanine dissolved. Then added some Bleach solution and the stuff went to a clear yellow. After that it became very hot and turned opaque, still yellow like lemonade and has a very strong pleasing smell that goes right up the skull ... wondering what that is - can't be P2P already, no? But what ist it? Very baffled on the strong reaction, any hints? Thanks!

Could be phenylacetaldehyde.

Reply author: java Replied on: Dec 20 2006 6:39:57 PM Message: Reference Information An Insight of the Reactions of Amines with Trichloroisocyanuric Acid

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De Luca,* Giampaolo Giacomelli SYNLETT 2004, No. 12, pp 2180–21840 Abstract: The reaction between amines or a-aminoacids with trichloroisocyanuric acid is studied under various conditions: N,Ndichloroamines, nitriles and ketones can be obtained from primary amines, while free aminoacids undergo oxidative decarboxylation to the corresponding nitrile of one less carbon atom. Key words: dichloroamines, trichloroisocyanuric acid, nitriles, aminoacids Download Attachment: An Insight of the Reactions of Amines with Trichloroisocyanuric Acid.pdf 70.24 KB Reply author: stooge Replied on: Dec 21 2006 11:16:45 AM Message: yes, seems pretty easy to get P2P from Phenylalanine that way, hard thing is to get it out there if you have no vacuum distiller ...

Reply author: stooge Replied on: Jun 21 2007 11:09:31 AM Message: wow - cool! but sorry for beeing a little dim (as always) - so you think you got phenylacetaldehyd now? i hope so! not bad! Reply author: java Replied on: Jun 21 2007 7:44:12 PM Message: Quote: Originally posted by aliced25 Oh, does anyone have this paper? LANGHELKD, Ber. 42, 392 (1909).

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Uber den Abbau der tc-Aminosiluren zlt fetten Aldehgden mittels Natriumhypochlorit K. Langheld: Ber. 42, 392 (1909).

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Phenylalanine +TCCA - Thread From WD

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